804: Start a Podcast: A Bright Future in Podcasting with Rob Greenlee

Speaker 1 0:00 a marketer of the Day episode 804 Start A Podcast a bright future in podcasting with Rob Greenlee.

Robert Plank 0:13 Hey, and welcome back to the marketer of the day podcast. We have Rob Greenlee from Libsyn here today, he has been around the block so many times with podcasting. He is responsible for so many innovations, and most importantly, making podcasting easy and fun. Rob, glad to see you again.

Unknown Speaker 0:29 It's great to be here. Thank you, Robert.

Robert Plank 0:32 And thank you ROM. And I mean, it's been so many years since we talked and what really impressed me a way back when we were talking about some of the like, the things you've built as far as the podcasting space. And way back, when you had this podcasting app, you had this whole platform where users could inject ads and other episodes, so people could just create their own podcast, and then kind of dynamically somehow behind the scenes, it could just drop in sponsorships, ads, things like that. And that really impressed me about kind of your what seems to be your approach towards podcasting, which is, it's away from a lot of like the pretentiousness and a lot of the mechanics and technicalities. And it seems like you're all about putting it to use right, creating cool things and creating something that that people will use. So I'm glad to be talking to you and diving into what what you're currently passionate about. So I mean, what is was new with you? What's your last like six to nine months of focus here?

Speaker 3 1:33 Well, I think that the focus that I've had here, you know, especially over the last six months is is just been trying to keep up with the changes in the medium, you know, the pandemic kind of reshuffled the deck a little bit of what was going on in the podcasting space to some degree around what content was popular, where people were consuming it. And just the continued growth of the medium and the expansion of the medium. In, in many, many different ways. I think to some degree, the the advertising market kind of pulled back a little bit. And, and I think we're we're continuing to see a little bit of struggles in the advertising side of things from the standpoint of, you know, metrics and analytics. But as far as on the content side, I think podcasting is just growing in leaps and bounds and the listening side is growing in leaps and bounds. So really just trying to keep up with all that, and continue to provide some leadership and some vision about what's what's coming. But yeah, over the last year, we've just seen an explosion of, of new podcasting contents come into the medium, at least new shows, whether or not you know, most of those new shows really stick around and continue producing content is really a much deeper question. But But I think overall, just the quality of podcasts and what's what's going on out there has been growing and the amount of people listening to podcasts on a global scale is also another factor here that is, is especially new. And I think that the pandemic really kind of opened up the floodgates on people's recognition that they can produce online content. So that's, that's how, you know, I've also upped my game in this area to I've got more of a professional production studio in my office now that has studio lights and high quality cameras and, and things that I can do more online just because you know, there weren't any live events going on. So, which is prior to pandemic, I was spending a lot of time traveling, going into podcasting conferences all over the country and, and that just came to a screeching halt. So I would say that those are the big things that I've been trying to try and keep up with.

Robert Plank 3:59 And there's lots to think about there. And, and even before the pandemic, I was already dialing back my attending of events, I was getting a little bored with it, or I would maybe attend something close like something that was like a half a day instead of a three day commitment. And, and it's I mean, you're so right that I mean the pandemic really mess things up for a lot of us. But it was like when when something in your business goes away, you have to figure out a way to replace it or fill the gap and, and I've seen a lot of people do that, like people who usually attend events or have a lot of speaking gigs would replace it with podcasting. And sometimes it was a like a more in quantity situation where they figured well, I used to be able to go to this event and speak in front of 200 people, but now I do a podcast and I mean what whatever the equivalent of that is is that that audience reach maybe you get more but they're not actual butts and seats, but then you can just be on a cop podcast, one after another and then in that whole thing that you mentioned how well the pandemic sort of forced us to up our game. And it seems like the technology, it seemed like it was a long time of catching up anyway, right, it seemed like like internet speeds, sped up a little bit. And as far as like the video conferencing, finally, a lot of that got figured out. And then I feel like how you said there about the production quality me personally, I feel like, I usually wait until I really have to, in order to like, get better equipment or up my game, I'm kind of my attitude is just like, make the content be myself. And then if I want to get a better camera, I will if I want to get a better microphone, I will. And I just I feel like it was helpful just to kind of maybe incrementally increase it as opposed to thinking like, it has to be super perfect right off the bat. And so just some of those things that you're mentioning there, I think, are helpful for people to just get started. And also that issue you mentioned of sometimes people start a podcast, but then they fall out. So I'm really curious about your thoughts on that. Because I mean, we see that everywhere, right about, they start with the best of intentions, they have all these ideas, they're excited, and then it dies. So with everything you're seeing with podcasting, like why does that happen? Why do people fall out of podcasting?

Speaker 3 6:14 Well, I think it's a combination of a lot of things, I think that the technology has gotten easier to use, and it's a lot easier. And there's free hosting platforms that are out there now. And, and the tools of being able to record something on your mobile device. And is, is basically making it so anybody can produce a podcast. And oftentimes that process can be not as thought through or planned out as it maybe should. And people are, you know, kicking tires, like they say, I mean, there's a lot of people that, that try it out, and it may not be for them. And that that's what is great about the free hosting platforms is that it's a risk free place to get in there and see if this is a medium for them. And I think that's what we've seen happen as people have been, during the pandemic period, people have been searching for other ways to produce content online, because people were spending more time in their offices, they were probably upgrading their ability to the, you know, to get quality recordings on Zoom calls and, and to do do things more online, I saw in the early days that you probably saw it too is that a lot of the even the larger media companies were really struggling with this, as they were, you know, a lot of their their talent on television, were not going into the studios anymore. So they were doing a lot of their stuff from home. And, and a lot of them were really caught off guard by by what was happening. And they didn't really have their act together in their own home offices, because they, they really weren't producing content there. So we saw, I thought it was amusing during that time, because I've been doing online shows from my home office for like since, like 2002, if that tells you anything, to see these big, big media craters kind of struggle with this concept of actually setting up your home office as a place that you can produce online content. And, and so so that's kind of what we saw there as well. So people just had, you know, this extra time because they weren't commuting. And they thought, you know, I can make some money from podcasting. You know, there's guys like Joe Rogan out there, they're the sign $100 million licensing deals, well, I can do the same thing. And I can make a couple million dollars by creating a podcast, but you know, it, it takes a lot of effort to create a podcast, it's not an easy thing to do, and to have a show that's generating a million dollars is not something that's that's happened very many times really, in truth be told so. So it has to be something very, very special. That gets that kind of traction. And oftentimes it takes years of consistent effort and, and getting your reputation built, getting your distribution built, creating better and better content, to build that community and build that audience. And people just, you know, think that it's going to happen overnight, and it doesn't and some stop producing episodes because they have other things going on with their jobs or they have a health problem or family obligations, you know, kind of get in the way those kinds of things. So it takes a lot of planning to start a podcast and be successful with it.

Robert Plank 9:41 So So pretty much what I'm getting from your answer there is that people drop off a pot. Well, first of all, it seems like it's okay. It's not necessarily a bad thing. People might just have other other priorities. And at least those those shows still live especially if they're on a free house and they're and there's no bill to pay. Those episodes might live Have there for years decades. But what what I'm getting from your answer there is that podcasting is not a magic bullet, right? It makes me think back to like, the.com era, where if someone thought that if they had, if they had like a business that was anything internet, they would get funding or like, if years ago it was if you did anything cryptocurrency or anything artificial intelligence, it was that buzzword. And the way you describe it there, it's like, well, if you build a YouTube channel, you're not going to make a million dollars right off the bat if you build a blog. And so this whole podcasting thing, it seems to be just another way, like a different kind of mode, to make your own content and to reach other sorts of people. And sure there are there it seems like every year there's another bump in listenership maybe due to like cars or smart speakers, or are people have more time at home with pandemic? So it's like, not not just a magic bullet. And so, as far as what people are doing, right, right, like you said that, you know, sometimes we it takes a while to get the home office space set up, even if you're like a late night talk show host. And so what do you like, happening with podcasts? Are you like me? Do you like seeing the quality steadily increase? Or do you think that, like you said, do we need more of a plan? Like, what do you like about podcasting, especially about what who you see as the successful podcasters?

Speaker 3 11:23 Well, I see, I mean, it's always been an energizing medium for me, I mean, I've been working in the medium, kind of on the platform side content, working with content creators for over 17 years. So it's, it's been something that I've seen since the very, very, very beginning. And people you know, the people in this medium, are, are really dynamic, really interesting people, they have an inspiration to share with others, and to collaborate, and I'm very, very much a partnership building kind of collaborator. And really, from the very early days of my efforts, in my, my, my radio show that I started out with back in 1999, is about getting other people involved in what I was doing, and getting audiences engaged getting guests on my show, I'd have as many as like, maybe three guests on each of my episodes, for many years, and have done, you know, I've done solo shows, I've done shows that had co hosts, I've had shows that had had regular guests on and a combination of that. So I've always been about, you know, about creating content and engaging with people, and podcasters are just, oftentimes, they're just amazing people, they, they just, they're inspiring to be around, I enjoy talking to them. And it's just something that's kept me energized over many, many years and, and working in a lot of different jobs and in in positions has put me in front of a lot of different people too. So it's, it's been a, it's been a really fascinating journey, the 17 years of working in the podcasting space, and it continues today. And I, I totally foresee you working in this, this medium for many, many years to come.

Robert Plank 13:18 And that that sort of topic that we're on, it's been on my mind lately as well, as far as like if if you have the right people, or you get yourself around a lot of people, a lot of the technicalities don't matter as much. And you're making me think back to maybe the frustrations I've had, like if I think of well, what's a bad podcast host or a bad podcast guest or someone that I just clash with? And usually it was if the the other person would not adapt to me or vice versa. Like if we were if we were not adaptable, dynamic, whatever you want to call it, like, I wouldn't I would come across and I'm sure you've come across with people where you ask one question, and it's like 15 minute long answer, or you ask a question, and it's like 15 second answer. And it just drives me crazy. Either like, Okay, I have to keep coming up with stuff or I have to get a word in. And when it's like when there's better flow. It's when you just, it's more like a like a dance where you kind of feel each other out. And like you said, they're like sometimes you've been solo guest like a panel or multiple guests. And so it seems like that's something maybe we all need to sit up and pay attention to and try to maybe push outside our comfort zone somewhat. And to be more of like an adaptable person, especially when we're thrown into a conversation like this where I got to figure out my connection on Skype or zoom or get my audio working just kind of go with the flow and and adapt to it.

Speaker 3 14:41 I think you do have to be be adaptable. And I think podcasting does put you in as in a in a mental state where we're, you know, technology doesn't always work. And I think also, just, I think a lot of things that you can learn from podcasting are very applicable to building a Stronger career for yourself too. You know, it's not all about just creating, you know, a business around podcasting, it's, it's your, your personal development, you know, I know for me, it's it's really been a personal development journey, and all about confidence building around knowledge, gaining knowledge from other people, as well as sharing knowledge with other people. So it's, it's this free flow of information if you think about the early days of the of the internet and the web. And that's what my early radio show that I did was about the growth and development, the world wide web and the internet and how that was such a collaborative environment, that that's collaboration, and that sharing was at the core of the development of the worldwide web, and how people shared snippets of code, HTML code and the early days, and then how people shared RSS feeds and which are kind of the prevalence and use of RSS feeds today is kind of in a state of decline. But and that's not necessarily a bad thing. You know, that's kind of a geeky thing, right? There's a lot, there's a lot more people getting involved in this medium now that are not technologists, right. They're there, they just want to create content, or they just want to talk or they just want to build a personal brand and a relationship with an audience. And technology shouldn't get in the way that technology should enable that. And, and I think that's what we're seeing the evolution happens isn't technology is enabling better connections between people.

Robert Plank 16:38 And when you're mentioning, the early days of the internet, I was just thinking the other day that it's easy to remember things as they were incorrectly or to remember things maybe more basic than they were because for some reason, when I think about like early internet days, I think static HTML pages, right, like the HTML code, but way back in the good old days, there were still guest books, there were still web rings, or people would kind of forge these alliances and link to each other. It was it was a lot more primitive than but like the internet, even in the early days was still like dynamic and was still about people and ensure when you had an audio it would take, like so much space, and it would take so long to put on a web page, you had to fiddle with real player. Sure, but it was all still there. And and like, like you said there like the technology needs to be about enhancing and making it easier, not just another obstacle in the way. And so when you mentioned that it makes you wonder like, Okay, so there's all these things that we could we could all be doing with podcasting, right, we could all be like taking out clips and putting them on social, we could all be sending, you know, a blast your email list every time there's an episode. So do you think there is something with podcasting, that is very doable, that we're all missing out on that, like needs to happen? Is there like an untapped thing that podcast hosts are missing out on?

Speaker 3 18:02 I think oftentimes, it's just keeping up with the, the the evolution and the technology improvements in the medium. You know, it's it's hard for people to know, sometimes, especially when new things come out what what is worth doing and what isn't worth doing. And and what is, what is the priorities of what people should do, based on what their goals are with their podcasts? I mean, there, there are people out there doing podcasts that care more about who's listening to their podcast, and how many. So that changes your your focus, and that also changes your your strategy and how you use technology and how you how you deploy it as a podcaster. And I think that, you know, that needs to be something that that is adjustable. And in we we need to be open to new new ways of thinking about podcasting in its its role. Yeah, I mean, I think as you look back to the past, a lot of the same concepts that existed in the past still exist today. I mean, not that much has changed really, around podcasting. And in a lot of ways. You know, a lot of the things that I've learned, doing my radio show and doing many podcasts that I've done over the years and pod faded from many of them as well. So is that content is content in how you produce it is important and how you connect with audiences, but it's all relative to what your goals are. It's all relative to what you're trying to do with the show and what who you are and how, what you bring to it from a host perspective and, and a value perspective to a listener and, and that's it. There's no one way to do it and and there's no magic sauce to it, other than I think that there is a certain that This applies to all content is that there is an IT factor or, or a factor that's understandable. It's like what makes us successful television show that everybody wants to watch. It's it's not something that you can just manufacture. It's something that happens based on chemistry. It happens based on on evolution. It comes from being in touch with who your audiences. And so it's a combination of all those things. So it's, yeah, podcasting is a fascinating medium. And it's, in a lot of ways, getting pulled a lot into watching YouTube videos these days, too, because it's very similar and niche also.

Robert Plank 20:40 And I've been doing that too, I've been, I'm not really much of a of a podcast subscriber, I'll like my own listening habits, like I'll jump in on someone's random episodes. And then for a while there, I was following maybe like four or five people. But then lately, I've been kind of more of a YouTuber also, I'll go in and and I'm only interested in maybe like four to seven minute clips, and I'll load up the watch later section. And then later on when I feel like it all kind of play a playlist as opposed to that long form factor. But I also know that that won't last I don't know that my own listening habits will change in a few months, kind of like you said, You've pod faded out, even like your own shows, and things like that. And so So yeah, it's like, it seems like a blending of different factors, like you said, like, what makes a good TV show that like if it's has good writing, it has good characters, if it seems like they, once the actors get in it for a few episodes, they kind of adjust based on the actors is a kind of appeal to the masses. So like lots of different factors. And so that's kind of it's reassuring, because it's easy to compare yourself to others, and to see what they're doing and kind of just copy them on like a superficial sense. But what you're saying is, well, they have a goal, and the activities they're doing are leading them towards that goal. So instead of copying the activities, you say, well, here's my own goal. And then maybe I can pick and choose which activities will then leading me to my goal. And then you're also saying here that there's like this curiosity factor in play at all times. And what's what's new, and what's hot and what's being revisited. And I mean, when clubhouse first came out, I was like, oh, cool, what's this? And then I didn't really get it. And I joined a few chat rooms. And I was thinking like, isn't, isn't this technology like the same as always, it's walkie talkies, it's party line. It's almost like IRC chat. I think like ICQ used to have like an audio feature. It just, it seems like the old things new again, but like trends come and go. And so if you if you had to like focus on just this one marketing tactic, then you wait two months, and then that's already sort of out of date. So I like that a lot that it's about the goal, and about about just being curious. And then there's something else you said in there about, like, instead of like there's thinking about how many or who or something along those lines. Right. And well, yeah.

Speaker 3 22:58 I mean, if you're trying to create a show about a specific topic that is targeted towards a certain value relationship with a certain type of audience, then you should care also about who's listening. Because that means that you're, you're, you're able to target that content to an audience that you're trying to reach. So, and oftentimes, you know, the potential of that can be all over the map, too. And I think a lot of people think that when they launch a podcast on any topic, that it can be a show that could be as big as Joe Rogan. And that that's just not necessarily true. A content a piece of content is only going to grow to the level that it can grow based on its appeal. Right? So it's hard to know, as a content creator, if I have a passion for something that that means that 10 million other people have that same exact passion, or that same approach that that attracts a large amount of people to I mean, each of us is an individual that has unique abilities and talents that may or may not have the ability to attract 10 million people to listen to my podcasts, but it might attract 1000 people. And that may be enough.

Robert Plank 24:21 Yeah, attracting the right people. And so, and I want to get in a few minutes here into the new media show and Libsyn but as we're approaching that point, something that you mentioned, there has been on my mind and and I'm I've never been really quite sure how to put it into words, but it drives me crazy a little bit when people limit themselves with the scope of the show, right? Like you just mentioned about how it's okay if you have a niche audience, but but I've come across people that say My show is on this topic, and it's just about this and I say well, don't you know you have a friend that can talk about this other thing instead, like I want to have a podcast just about memberships writes, well, if you have a friend that owns a gym, or you want to promote like a, like a brick and mortar business, you can kind of make that work. So have you seen this? Or is this making any sense as far as like, the struggle between like a really boxed in podcast and like a bigger umbrella?

Speaker 3 25:14 Yeah, I think it's the it's, it's definitely a struggle. I think that when you're new to something, and you don't have a reputation, or a community that you've built around you, I think starting off with a broad topic can can actually slow your growth down. Because what you're doing is you're fragmenting your your interest around an audience. I mean, if you have a reputation for a particular area of expertise, I think that you can attract people much more easily to your podcast, across maybe a little bit broader scope of topics. But the topics need to be related to each other somehow, so so you can keep adding value to that particular audience. You know, I know that the the radio show that I did for for many years was called web talk. And that basically, was a topic area that that allowed me to go into any sub topic areas relating to the web and the internet, right. So you think about the trying to come up with a theme for your show, or a topic focus that is focused yet broad at the same time. So let's say you want to have a podcast about outdoor recreational vehicles or something like that, that is a niche, but it's also can be expanded, right, all of the areas that can go along with that. So you can keep producing content that's relevant to that audience, it may not be specifically about a car, but it could be about a service that does something in that area of interest, or does something with the car or it's a part for the car, or it's a accessory, or it's you know, so there's there's areas that have peripheral support systems that you can think about with any podcast topic that you come up with, if you can come up with a niche, but yet, it's a broad niche, I think that's the key to finding larger audiences. I mean, if you want to build a, an advertising supported show, what you have to build is a large community around that show. And large communities typically have a lot of diverse input in interest around a focused area. So let's say you want to create a show about, you know, even about jeeps, right? Or a topic like that, you can create a big community around that, because there's a lot of people that have different ideas about how to create a custom Jeep or, or, you know, the new models coming out every year or changes that are happening in the, you know, in events all over the place, and you can really expand your your topic, and I'll always have something new to talk about.

Robert Plank 28:04 And that's interesting to think about it in that way that broad, but also specific, and it seems like the way that you're explaining this is maybe start off, like name your show where it can expand. But start off specific, because there's probably probably, I imagine if, if someone's looking to start a podcast, that you might already have some ideas, they might already be able to hit the ground running and say, you know, I can already knock out these seven episodes about all these topics. And then as they get that audience, then if you have the Jeep podcast, then and you get a Jeep enthusiast, then there's all kinds of other kind of off the beaten path topics that Jeep people would would be interested in. And even as you explain those ideas, it's like, there's almost like probably categories, you could jump to as far as new content, like the news or something specific or activities, like so it's I like that idea, a lot of start specific and then make it broad later, almost as you as you kind of slow down on content, right, as you personally have less and less content to put out there. If you're getting repetitive, then expanded to new subtopics makes a lot of sense,

Speaker 3 29:09 right? I mean, because if you if you have an area that you're focused on that is too narrow, that that there isn't a community around somehow that already exists out there or could be created. I think a lot of the pod feeding happens from being too focused on a on a small niche that doesn't have a broad appeal. And in you basically run out of things to talk about. I mean, I've been podcasting about podcasting for 17 years, and I don't seem to ever run out of things to talk about

Robert Plank 29:41 it because you maintain their curiosity and you say flexible, adaptable, like we've been talking about if part of what's not serving us running out of content can adapt to that as well. So, so great. I mean, there's so much for us to chew on think about and and also as as far as your journey Like you said that you've had all these different companies you've been involved with. And you can probably go to like any any podcasting business that you want and jump in and do your thing. So why Lipson? why did why is your path led you to Lipson and why is Lipson so freakin great as a platform and a tool in an app?

Speaker 3 30:18 Well, I think for me why Lipson is Lipson was the very first podcast hosting platform to ever exist. They they came into existence the same time I started podcasting. So that's how far the company goes back. I mean, podcasting probably wouldn't exist today, in the form that it does if Lipson hadn't started because they were the first platform. I mean, prior to Lipson in this was when I started podcasting, I was hand coding RSS feeds. And making a lot of mistakes about it every other episode my my RSS feed would break because I'd use the wrong comma or something like that in my off my keyboard. So So podcast hosting platforms like Lipson have basically automated the the ability to publish and working at a company like Lipson has put me kind of at the center of the industry to some degree of, of being between distribution and, and the content creator side, which is, that's my roots. I mean, I was a content creator. To begin with, I was part of the the very early group of shows that enter the podcasting medium, and had a lot of experience taking shows out to streaming and getting it out into, you know, syndicated radio on the XM Satellite Radio Network site. I have a lot of experience across the board in this medium. And so sitting where I'm sitting is really, really the best place to be because I can, I can get on podcasts like yours, and I can create my own show and I can be on other people's shows. And I can contribute to this community from a basis of experience. And personal insight from all the relationships that I've had with the distribution companies, the monetization entities, advertisers, add buyers, to the hosting and listening sides. So I've I've worked for a large Podcast Network. I used to be the CTO for podcast one down in Los Angeles, which hosted the Adam Carolla podcast and the Shaq podcast and some of those ones. So I've been on the celebrity side too. But I've also worked for Microsoft, and ran the Zune podcasting platform for six years at Microsoft and used to work for Xbox as well. So I've got just kind of a huge base of background and exposure to all levels of content creators. And that just has put me in a great, great position. As far as Lipson goes, I mean, it's, it's a, it's a platform that was really built to support serious podcasters. And that's, that's why I got involved with them. I mean, I used to work for Spreaker. And Spreaker, was doing a lot of a lot of great stuff, too. I love the combination of live streaming, that they have live audio streaming with podcasting, that was really a cool thing for me, because I've always been kind of a live radio guy. So that was, that was great. And I still do a lot of lot of live stuff. I mean, my my new media show, which we're going to talk about is a is a live online show as well. So it's live on on the video side, which is something I didn't do in the past, because in the early days of the internet, you really didn't do video online, just because nobody could get it. So but things have changed on that front now. So that's my story, I'm sticking to it.

Robert Plank 33:50 And what's cool, what's cool about your story is you're sticking to this, this idea of blending the old and the new, because it's really easy to have all this experience and say, you know, I don't have any room in my brain to learn any, any new tricks, and I'm just gonna stick with B being a dinosaur. And I mean, I've been at this for 20 years too, and it's really tempting to just get settled in. And the good old days, like we were just talking about, like, oh, remember the good old days of geo cities and coding your RSS feed by hand and but like, no one cares about that. Right? And we've been talking a lot about, like tapping into your audience and playing to what your audience wants and kind of growing with them. And if you're just seeing as you've always been, then what the heck is the point of that? So it's good that you're kind of using that as an advantage and I mean, a lot of people use that in like later age too. Right? You have some 70 year old 80 year old Oh, I don't need to learn anything new. You still do and what's so what's cool about seeing what you've done is you've seen all these things and use it to enhance your just your new your new knowledge that you're you're figuring out and so so yeah, Lipson is for serious podcasters if you want to be a not so serious podcaster use one of those other terrible platforms, but but Lipson is one What you have to use if you're if you really want your podcasts to succeed, and I imagined that the is the new media show hosted on Lipson, it better be?

Speaker 3 35:09 No, it's actually not. It's actually hosted on blueberry. Oh, shoo competition. Why? Because my co host is actually the CEO of

Robert Plank 35:18 blueberry. So you're connected all kinds of ways. Yeah.

Speaker 3 35:22 So this is an unusual show, because it's it's co hosted by two competitors. So I work for Lipson and Todd works for blueberry. And the reason this show even exists is the fact that we started the show before we were competitors. So we just kept it going. So you know, I was working for Microsoft, when I started doing new media show with Todd every week. And they've been doing it for over 10 years. So it's a show about the really about the growth and development and the industry of podcasting. But it's also covered a lot of other topics around online video. And and so I mean, it's, it's truly a new media show. And I guess the question I keep asking, Todd is, is, when do we need to change the name of it? Because is this medium that we're doing online now still considered new? or at what point? Is it considered old medium? Right? I don't know. I don't know when that is,

Robert Plank 36:26 or in the middle, right? If there's like, traditional and then a podcast was new, but now it's in the middle on there something even better. But the way things are, it might just circle back around and be the same repeat of the old but the new anyways.

Speaker 3 36:37 Right? Right. In the name of it doesn't say new media show. I mean, it doesn't say New Media podcast, it says new media show. So just the just the premise of it was more about it being a show, regardless of what the distribution was. So and that's kind of what we've done.

Robert Plank 36:55 Like we've been saying, it can be on on YouTube, it can be live streamed, it can be on on podcast, and you're right there on brand by starting off specific, but new media show is in a way vague enough where it can expand to whatever the internet becomes. And so with all these episodes of the new media show, and all these things that you cover, like you said, You covered like online video, is there like a was there a really weird, unique standout episode in the mix? There's anything coming to mind? Yeah, I've,

Speaker 3 37:26 we did about about six months ago, we did an episode with Mr. Adam curry, who's the pod father of podcasting, he was a guest on the show. And there's been episodes in the past that we've done live on stage two in the past past past few years. And that's going to be happening again, at Podcast Movement, where we're going to do a live on stage episode of the, of the show. And it's usually done as almost like a panel session up on stage in front of a live audience. So that's the other aspect that we've moved into to here over the last couple of years is trying to do it more in the real world. And unfortunately, the pandemic kind of undermined a little bit of that for a while. But trying to get in front of people in the real world is is another aspect of podcasting that is going to come back here. As we come out of this, this pandemic lockdown stuff that we've been through over the last year. And it'll be exciting to see and a lot of podcasters make money from selling tickets to get into their podcasts, in a theater or in venues or at conferences, or those kind of things around the country. So it's, it's an interesting, you know, time that we're coming into right now. And I'm, I'm trying to adapt to how things may be different. You know, I think a lot of the the events that we've attended, at least the podcasting conferences are going to be hybrid events going forward, which means prior to COVID, they didn't really have an online virtual component to their in person events. But now they're going to have simultaneously going on at the same time, a virtual event with the in person event. And I'm not exactly sure how that's going to how that's going to work and how that's going to play out in people's experiences and how these events can grow from that because it certainly turns them into a global impact event. I know for many years, I was encouraging these in person events to do some more live stages and to do more on online on a virtual event basis. And they were most of them were pretty resistant to doing that because they thought it would discourage people from coming to the event. And now because of the pandemic we're seeing more of these events, just say well, I've got this expertise because that's what I had to do over the last year I might as well just add it to the in person event and see if I can grow the overall attendance of the conference.

Robert Plank 39:55 And yeah, now it seems like there's no choice or now it's it's almost expected and and it's seems like once, once smartphones and like Wi Fi and things like that became more and more widespread, it was like it was kind of creeping up on people running events. And I remember seeing that all over the place of being like resisting that change, because it would take away from the event. But now it's like, if there's a way to somehow added to that event, or if people are just if it kind of it's normalized, but why not embrace it? And why not just jump on the train of whatever new innovations are, are in in podcasting and live events and connected with other people, whatever the new innovation is, and so where can we sign up for Libsyn? And where can we check out the new media show?

Speaker 3 40:40 Well, if you wanted to go to lipson.com, and that's li B Sy, N, you can certainly sign up if you want to start hosting a podcast or create a podcast for your organization or yourself, you can certainly do that. It's it's as low as five bucks a month to get started. So it's it's not expensive to get going. And, and how you can get a hold of me, I can certainly be reached by email, if you want to send me an email. Rob g@lipson.com. It'd be great to hear from you. And I've got I've got a presence in all the social media platforms too. I'm on Twitter at Rob Greenlee. And I do have a website at Rob greenlee.com. So there's lots of ways I'm totally accessible.

Robert Plank 41:25 Nice in every possible medium there is because Why limit yourself if it's there, create an account have a have a path for free will to find you. That is Rob g@libsyn.com that is taught at Rob Greenlee and all these platforms, Li B Sy n.com It's only five bucks a month, don't wait, get your podcasts online, make those few clicks, record that first episode, that way you have something that can grow with you. And that way, you have the ball rolling, and you'll be so glad that you created a podcast that will live on now and forever. And as we wrap up wind Brian down here, Rob, is there anything that comes to mind as far as like anything we like left out or like any like final parting words for us?

Speaker 3 42:06 I just think if you're going to be a content creator online, and this goes beyond just podcasting is just, you know, think about what your goals are, think about what you're you might want to try to accomplish by by doing that in what aspect of your life can it add to, you know, it can be creating, creating a show on LinkedIn, or it could be creating a show on on Facebook or something, you know, creating content online can can transform your life, it can transform your career. There's just a lot of lot of opportunity there. And podcasting is just one one option. But you can also think about it as a synergistic approach to the podcast for many is the is the core, and then all these other things that you do with video or all this kind of extra that you do for marketing purposes to drive, drive some attention to your podcast. So it just depends on how you want to approach it. But yeah, it's more about just getting focused on what your goals are and in what you're trying to accomplish. I think it's the big, big takeaway. This is Robert

Robert Plank 43:19 plank from DF Why podcast.com Ford Slash Free. Me and my team are super excited to jump into your podcast, whether it already exists, whether it's brand new, whether it's just in the idea stage, set up a call and contact us today claim your free gift at deify podcast.com/free and we will see you there