950: Gray Dot SEO Digital Strategy Consultancy: Unlock Long-Term Business Growth from Data-Driven Analytics with Sam Torres

Robert Plank 0:04 Hey, and welcome back to the podcast. We're here with Sam Torres, who is the Chief Digital Officer, and co founder of the grey dot company. They are a consulting firm that specializes in SEO and data analysis for regulated industries, nonprofit organizations, and SAS. So we're gonna find out today all about these insights about blending creativity, and technical skills for writing services, all that fun stuff. So Sam, nice to meet you.

Unknown Speaker 0:31 Nice to meet you. Thanks so much for having me on.

Robert Plank 0:34 Glad to have you. And so what is sort of like the the elevator pitch, right, the quick bio, you and your company? What do you do? How do you stand out?

Speaker 2 0:43 So we kind of have two different arms. So the first would be your more classical technical SEO and strategic SEO services, for helping to rank higher on Google. The other side is that we actually take those typical seo keyword research methods and apply them to other parts of your business. So that's something that we call digital consumer intelligence. So we're looking at search trends, what's going on and tick tock on YouTube, plugging into all these third party API's to really start to understand more about your marketplace and like, say, answer your questions that have nothing to do with your marketing. So what kind of hiring plans do you need to have based on what industries or new markets you'd want to enter things like that, so we have a lot of fun with it.

Robert Plank 1:26 Amazing. And, you know, sometimes you come across some kind of a company where they have a YouTube channel or like LinkedIn articles, and some of the things they post I'm like, wow, they always have like, fresh ideas, they're not just cranking out the keywords, not just coming up with like 50 videos, they always have like, really good hooks, and really like well developed content. So I imagine that all of this kind of recurring deep thinking, connecting the API's looking at the trends kind of helps to, to really like have the ear the grounds, or to be kind of like ahead of the marketplace, right be kind of having those discussions, where you look like a thought leader instead of a follower.

Speaker 2 2:07 Exactly. That's probably one of the biggest things about search volume, it's incredible data, the amount of data that we get really for free with it, is just phenomenal. However, it's always going to be historical. So it's always going to be looking back, and it doesn't really give you the ability to look forward. So that's one of the things that like I say, plugging into YouTube looking at tick tock, what are the trends on there, what's going on in Reddit, those are areas where you can really start to get ahead and be a little bit more proactive with your messaging instead of reactive. So there's just really a lot of power in that. Cuz we've seen tons of studies to where, you know, tick tock is really driving all kinds of trends and demand. And if you're not really thinking about that, then you're gonna miss out on the conversations for sure.

Robert Plank 2:53 And so you have any fun stories like that to share with us because like, it's, I'm getting all these like cool ideas in my head. And this, this whole concept of like, looking at tick tock for the future ideas is amazing. But it helps me to, like hear an actual story of like a client case study. So what do you have in that department?

Speaker 2 3:09 Sure. So we've got a few different use cases that I can talk about. And one of my favorites is actually where we start using that data to influence product roadmaps. So we've worked with quite a few clients, but one of our ecommerce clients, we worked with them to really figure out what new products should they look at carrying based on where trends are going. They do mostly home design type products. So really looking at you know, Pinterest, again, tick tock tick tock stitch is a trove of information to really understand what kind of trends are starting to come up, that the demand is actually going to start coming pretty soon. So we actually were able to pull that data to then help them go to their various vendors that supply their products and negotiate from there about what products actually matter to them, based on where they see the market going. So that's one of the most like tactile examples we've got. Another is that we got to work with a streaming platform, a pretty large one. And we use that to help with their content programming. So really helping them come up with what kind of content should they be producing on their channels, including their their owned media, that will really start to engage more viewers, get those subscribers and then also start hitting them in other channels more than just their single platform. So using that is really powerful. Another example that's kind of similar to that that I can actually go into if you've heard of the site craftsy so it was a really just a platform where crafters and creators can add their projects and they can also upload patterns to sell and things like that crochet videos, all kinds of stuff. We use content programming and the research to really figure out okay, which class should you promote which class should You have somebody actually produce for you what's going to be worth it based on what people are looking for, because their ultimate goal was to build the audience continue growing the platform, and really became a marketplace for creators and crafters. And that was that was one of the ways we did it is really just identifying what kind of content is really going to bring the most people to your door, so that you can at least start that conversation with them. So those are a few of the more tactile detailed examples where we've like, say, we've gotten to have a lot of fun, we dig into a lot of data. So thank goodness for machine learning, because that makes it so much more tangible and able to process because one of the huge powers of this is that, you know, typically market research, you know, your traditional like a Gartner or Forrester, you're looking at, what six months is best case scenario, probably looking more like nine to 18 months for a project to run. And we can do these projects in about three weeks. Because the data is just all there. So it's really fun.

Robert Plank 6:01 And it sounds fun. Yeah, and those are wonderful examples. And I can definitely see the value in not guessing, right? Because it's easy to just kind of look at, look at the red hats, look at the tiktoks look at the Google search results and just kind of be like, Okay, let me see these results. Okay, looks like a good idea. I'll make this for my new crafting class, I'll make this smart my new video. But that's just at the mercy of what you happen to come across. And then also you were mentioning before about how when you just look at the keyword data than the the other extreme problem there is you're looking at all the historical things some years past and not necessarily getting on to the cutting edge. So I can see how helpful it can be to make these data based decisions instead of just guessing you're basing it on logic and what you see in front of you. And so with all of the this kind of like method that your company has developed and use has anything surprised you? Has there been any situation where like, you started off digging through the data, this three week process? And you're going in one direction, and something else kind of confused you and made you change course?

Speaker 2 7:10 Oh, what a great question. So I'd say there's that moment on probably every project. So my camera just went out. So sorry.

Robert Plank 7:25 No surprises, right. Technology are unexpected. Yeah.

Speaker 2 7:30 But yes, the. So usually the surprise that happens, like the one that happened with the streaming platform, the amount of search that was happening in other languages, based on the markets and locations that we were looking at was pretty surprising. So I mean, but yeah, there's that happens almost in every project where something comes up. Often it has to do with word choice. So really just looking at, you know, one of my favorite examples is when looking at terms of law. And this is more like a classic SEO, but it can help illustrate. For all types of law, if someone was typing the word lawyer, that usually showed that they were any more informational their their data gathering mindset. Whereas once the user starts using the word attorney, they're actually ready to buy, they're ready to pick up the phone and have an engagement. So that was true in all cases of law that I've studied except for divorce lawyer, and I think there's just the colloquialism of divorce lawyer is such a popular term, unfortunately. So all of that being said, like looking at the word choice, and how that really dictates where a user is in their journey, or how soon they are to convert. Those are usually the things that through these projects, you're just like, wow, now that I see that it makes so much sense, but I never would have estimated that before. Right? It's not something I would have guessed. And I will say I've been doing this for 13 years. I'm just always flabbergasted at how much people can't spell. That's my base. But other than that, yeah, usually the word choice is where you find really interesting nuggets and things that are very unexpected.

Robert Plank 9:22 Interesting and again, and how specific it can be and how like the end like if you didn't actually like look at it repeatedly and day after day you think oh divorce attorney or like or I'm sorry, lawyer or attorney, same interchangeable, you know, result but you say different levels of awareness, depending on what exactly that they are searching. And so we were talking also when we introduced you and we talked about your bio, how you're in some of these sorts of specific niches right? You're into like the regulated industries and nonprofit and so like, what's that about? How did that happen? And then why do that why specialized that deep?

Speaker 2 10:00 So with regulated industries, it's really just about how do you work with compliance teams. And it's something that me and my business partner, Tory Gray, we've both had our fair share. So we have one of the things we really pride ourselves on is we work in the world of the real. We feel that many SEO agencies, if there are really just SEO specialists, if they're not as experienced, they're going for like, it has to be this way every time. And unfortunately, just because of whether it's business cases, technology challenges, whatever it is, that's not always possible. And so you have to find creative solutions around it to kind of get you halfway there, or really figure out where the compromise is, right? How many times are there, you know, branding is butting heads with paid media, right? It happens all the time, because paid media wants all the conversions, but branding wants to make sure that the spirit of the company is intact. That happens way too often, across the company. And so that's something that we've really specialized in is figuring out how do we get all the right people at the table. And then from there, decide the best way forward, given those challenges. Also, just regulated industries tend to be for me a little bit more fun, because they're a little bit more challenging. You're usually talking b2b, or you're talking your money or life site. So that means we have to be really careful about making sure we're presenting the right information, we're supporting the authority of the client. You know, obviously, if they have a legal team, we need to make sure everything's completely accurate and factual. But of course, now with all the AI and AI generated content is becoming more and more important that you need to fact check everything. So that's how we got into the regulated industries. And then nonprofits, that's just passion projects for us, we want to give back as much as we can. And then we also do a lot actually in the tech space, especially, you know, SAS products, but cutting edge tech, it's just because we are able to usually understand their products in a way that maybe other marketing agencies aren't able to do quite yet. Just because I am a former front end developer, and both me and my business partner are married to developers. So there's just a lot of tech in our lives. And so it's a language that we speak pretty well. And we enjoy it because we see the potential of a lot of these these solutions or technologies. And I

Robert Plank 12:27 can definitely see, I can see how you've like accumulated these skills over different careers and being in different industries to kind of create something that's unique. And what's what I'm picking up on a little bit from you is this whole, I don't know if it's like a, like entrepreneurial or business owners mindset of like wanting to solve the hard problems, right? Like when we were we were kids, we always thought, Oh, well, I can't wait until I'm an adult. And life is way easier, and I can do whatever I want. Little do we know that things become harder, but then the point of living in the point of being in business and making money and growing a company is not for things to be easy. It's just to, you know, solve problems to have these solutions. And there's some aspect of like, the, it can be fun, right? Hard can be fun, especially when you solve things that maybe take you a little bit of work, you get the satisfaction at the end, or you solve these problems that other people can't solve. But but you and your team in your company can. So can you explain kind of your your thoughts on this a little bit, just this whole? The enjoyment of solving the hard problems?

Speaker 2 13:30 Sure. So actually, for me, it's really easy. I hate being bored. So a challenge is what I'm always looking for. It's one of the things I love about SEO, it's constantly evolving. What I do today is not what I did, not even a month ago, let alone 10 years ago. So for me, it's just it's that I want to be constantly growing. I love to learn if you're familiar with Clifton Strengths Finder, my number one is input. I just want to learn as much as I can all of the time, that it's actually a running joke that I need to sleep more. Because I just always want to want to find new things. Because it's just for me, it is fun, like you say it's it's finding solutions to problems, I try to automate my life as much as possible, so that I can spend time on the things that really matter. So I think that's that's ultimately what it comes from. It's just, I hate being bored. And I want to be able to go play Roblox with my six year old and not have to worry about deadlines. So

Robert Plank 14:37 I think that's something we can all pay attention to and listen to is using boredom as a motivator to automate, to focus to get the work tasks done in a reasonable amount of time. That way we can leave it there that way we can go and have fun, do the important things with our family and just kind of have that always continuous intake. And so that way you can be always growing and always moving on from, like you said what you were doing a month ago or two months ago, and just always be doing something new. So that way, the life is not always the same every week, because who wants that? Who wants that kind of repetition? That seems like a recipe for a life that just flies by. And we want to have an adventurous life with all its ups and downs, and everything that comes along with it. So along those lines of avoiding boredom, and going on to the next opportunities, is there anything upcoming that you feel like sharing about you and your journey and your company, anything happening soon in the future you feel like mentioning?

Speaker 2 15:38 Well, so for the SEO world, there's just tons happening when it comes to AI. So Google is testing the search generative experience, which, for those who haven't heard about it, definitely look it up. It's very interesting. It's very much in beta. And so I think, you know, honestly, what we're going to see is, it's going to be a pretty tumultuous time for the next year or for digital marketing. Because Google has just been shown up, they've been having a hard time, but open API came out with chat GPT. And then Microsoft got in on that, and it's integrated into Bing. So I would say just kind of buckle up and be ready for a bumpy ride. For anybody who's in marketing, and especially in the digital space, because the game is currently being rewritten, and we're not sure exactly where things are gonna fall out. I'm also most interested to see how the public responds to AI. Right? We've already seen that kids are getting kicked out of college for using chat GPT to write their papers, we've seen lawyers getting disbarred because it wrote their closing remarks, which I mean, obviously was pretty, pretty silly on on the lawyers part, like do your due diligence, for sure. Right. So what I'm I'm concerned about is that all this AI, which is very exciting, and could, I think could bring us closer to our own humanity, I think there's a really real chance of it actually furthering us from our humanity. So it's going to be really interesting to see how all of that plays out. And like I say, where the public kind of comes out on trusting it, because we're seeing all these errors and non factual information come out. But obviously, there's no litigation, there's no precedent on how these things are handled. So it's going to be interesting, and I certainly will not be bored. Next year.

Robert Plank 17:29 Great and interesting is good. And you know, exciting, and newness is good. And it seems like with any new technology, whether it's aI social media, there's always two sides of the coin, right, you could be one of those people that doesn't know how to use it, or that ignores it to your own peril, or uses it for the wrong thing like social media, distancing us instead of bringing us closer together. So there's always the the two paths that can be taken. And so it's just a good reminder lesson for me hearing from you to embrace that change. And to be excited about all the new layers of SEO rules they pile on are the arms race with Google and Microsoft, and who knows who else with with AI. And so exciting times ahead. And so if someone is impressed by the advice you gave today, and they want to reach out to you find out more about your company, what you can do, what's the call to action? What's the next step web address?

Speaker 2 18:22 Sure. So you can go to our website at the grey dot company. So it's th e, g, Ra y period company. Or you can always reach out to us on Twitter, we're very active, that grey.co

Robert Plank 18:35 Fantastic, the gray dot company. And as we wrap up our conversation here, Sam, I always like to put my guests on the spot and estimate the very end about advice you wish you'd gotten 20 years ago, it's kind of a kind of a brain teaser kind of question. So if I asked you, is there any advice you wish you'd gotten 20 years ago? What do you have to say?

Speaker 2 18:56 I really, especially for those who are trying to grow in leadership, the key is authenticity. Trying to be your own authentic self is how you're going to be most successful as a colleague, as a manager, when you are trying to adopt somebody else's leadership style, or emulate someone else, it's always going to come off as inauthentic because it is. So really just, you know, take the time to figure out who you are and how you want to lead. How you want to influence I say would also be the most important part. Because authenticity is going to be what really allows you to build a great team or have solid connections. And those connections are really the biggest part of your career. It's it is all about who you know, and being at the right time at the right place. Like I bet flip that but yeah, be authentic. Is this something I wish had been stressed to me in my younger years?

Robert Plank 19:59 Great advice. So we should be seeking our that inner authentic self and valuing people being a good leader inspiring others. And if you author in podcast land say, Okay, I need my company to accurately express what we do. I need to be tapped into the latest SEO trends and artificial intelligence. I know that I'm doing everything right. You need to go right now to the gray dot company. And check out what Sam and her team can do for you. So get that conversation started. Contact them right now. Go ahead do right now. We'll see you over there. And Sam, super great speaking with you. I appreciate you.

Unknown Speaker 20:34 Yes. Thank you so much. This is fun.

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